Berlinale Honoree Michelle Yeoh on Hollywood Ageism, ‘W…

Michelle Yeoh, who made history three years ago becoming the first Asian to win the best actress Oscar, is in Berlin to receive the Honorary Golden Bear and will next be celebrated with a star on the Hollywood Walk of Fame. But don’t expect her to simply bask…

Michelle Yeoh, who made history three years ago becoming the first Asian to win the best actress Oscar, is in Berlin to receive the Honorary Golden Bear and will next be celebrated with a star on the Hollywood Walk of Fame. But don’t expect her to simply bask in the glow and be complacent. Feisty as ever, the “Crazy Rich Asians” and “Wicked” star says the bold speech she made on the Dolby Theatre stage when accepting her trophy for “Everything Everywhere All at Once” (“Ladies, never let anyone tell you you are past your prime”) still feels uncomfortably timely, because not enough has changed for women, especially when it comes to ageism in Hollywood.

“Let’s not let them define us as women or put us in a box and say, ‘Oh, well, because now you’re this age, you should only play a grandmother,’” she said in a candid interview with Variety at the Ritz-Carlton Hotel in Berlin ahead of her tribute. “I’m like, ‘Hell, no. I will kick ass because I want to, and I still can.’”Yeoh is equally outspoken about Hollywood’s growing reliance on data-driven greenlighting.

“I don’t like the fact that I have to do or tell stories according to an algorithm,” she says. “They also have to have a feel for real people, not just what the machine tells you.”The actor has yet to get over the Oscar snub for “Wicked: For Good,” in which she reprised her role as Madame Morrible, starring opposite Ariana Grande and Cynthia Erivo. “I’m not surprised. I am in shock!” she says.

“It’s such a beautiful, well-made movie… So I was truly, truly very disappointed.” Yeoh also points to the slow progress for Asian-led storytelling in movies and series in the wake of “Crazy Rich Asians” and “Everything Everywhere All at Once.” “It’s not every day you get ‘Everything Everywhere All at Once,’” she says. “But if you look at the other — I hate to say — Caucasian films, they keep telling many different stories.

So this is what we have to do … tell many stories so that we will continue to have a seat at the table.” Yeoh actually spent time in Asia recently. While she’s currently on a break from the shoot of ““The Wandering Earth 3” in China, she also shot the short “Sandiwara” in Penang with “Anora” filmmaker Sean Baker, who will give her the honorary tribute in Berlin. “When they sent me the synopsis, I was going, ‘Are you crazy?

What are we doing?’” she recalls with a laugh. “And then in two days, we made a short film… Sean Baker is an astounding filmmaker. I mean, he was on the bicycle with his iPhone!” You’re going to receive the Hollywood Walk of Fame Star next week. How does it feel? I remember when I first went to the Walk of Fame because it’s very iconic. You want to go there because all your big heroes who’ve been in the business since you were a kid are there.

And I remember looking, “Oh, here’s so and so!” So now just to think that I’m getting it, it’s a dream come true. Both Jon M. Chu and Ang Lee will be there to emcee the ceremony honoring you on the Hollywood Walk of Fame. What do these two filmmakers mean to your career and to you on a personal level? They are not just directors in my life. They are family, especially Ang, because we’ve known each other now for … maybe 30 years?!

And I’m still very close with Ang and Jane, his wife. So it just feels right that he should be there. I remember on “Crouching Tiger,” when we were doing press and all that, he was always there, advising, assisting, making sure that we were doing the right things. Because at that time, Hollywood was still very new to us. I’m very, very touched he’ll be coming all the way from New York, where he lives, to do this.

But then, to be fair, every time I ask him to do something, he’s never said no!And Jon Chu … I always remember when I made “Crazy Rich Asians” with him and I said, ‘You remind me of someone. You remind me of Ang.’” He’s like my adopted son. He’s grown and matured into such an amazing director and so working with him in “Wicked” 1 and 2 was a joy. When he calls you, you’re also there for him, right?

I read that at first you didn’t really want to be in this franchise. Not that I didn’t want to be. You’re talking about a film with Cynthia Erivo and Ariana Grande and there’s singing involved. I was like, “Jon, this Madame Morrible sings, right? And I don’t sing.” That’s the thing about taking risks, you know? And Jon, who’s so charming, was like, “Ah, it’s a piece of cake!” And I think at the end of the day, you have to be willing to learn a new skill, basically.

So they found me an amazing voice coach. And I learned so many things. Generally, I’m terrified of singing because I think I have a very husky low voice. I mean, in the mornings, when I call down for room service, there’ll be “Yes, Mr. Yeoh,” and I’m like, “Dude, my dad is not here, OK?” They always mistake me for a guy.Were you surprised “Wicked: For Good” didn’t get a single Oscar nomination?

I’m not surprised. I am in shock! I really am. I think sometimes the problem is that people think, “Oh, you already got so much with the first one, let other people have a chance.” But then it feels like, “No, come on!” It’s such a beautiful, well-made movie. Paul [Tazewell] for costume design, hair and makeup. If you compare it [with contenders this year] it should be there. For Jon Chu, for [DP] Alice Brooks, for the set design.

It’s not the replica of the first one. It’s more elaborate and there are many more new destinations in “Wicked: For Good.” So I was truly, truly very disappointed.You mentioned that Hollywood has changed so much in the last 30 years. What do you think has changed? I think Hollywood just keeps changing, evolving, and changes are necessary. I mean, the way they’ve always treated women needed that change.

The lack of women in all the different roles in front of and behind the camera is changing, and that is necessary. I think it needs to have more faces that look like mine, stories that are there. And sometimes you go like, Wow, why hasn’t this been told earlier? I love the fact that “Shōgun” got so many accolades. I was very disappointed when “The Brothers Sun” did not get picked up for Season 2, because that is part of the culture of Los Angeles.

I would love to be able to see many more faces like mine in movies or TV series that are contemporary, and not just of the past. Change is always difficult because some people are very complacent. They are afraid that if it changes, they might lose out. But you have to evolve and you have to move forward. And if you think about it, your audience changes. And I’m not talking about algorithms. I don’t understand them and I don’t like the fact that I have to do or tell stories according to an algorithm.I’m guessing you’re not going to make movies for Netflix?

No. Well, Netflix has been very important for many filmmakers, to be fair to them. But the thing is, I hope they change. I hope they also understand that it’s not always the algorithm that works, because they also have to have a feel for real people, not just on what the machine tells you. I don’t know how it works, to be honest.“Everything Everywhere All at Once” must have felt like a gamble based on the script, right?

On paper, nobody saw it coming. It’s like all the different genres all mashed into one, wearing hot dogs with fingers…It hits you on the spot in so many places and there’s something for everyone, whether you’re a mother, whether you’re a father or a daughter. And life is about taking risks.When you won the Oscar three years ago, you made a very memorable speech, saying “Ladies, don’t let anyone tell you you are past your prime.” Would you make the same speech today?

I wouldn’t say that that line doesn’t fit today because it hasn’t changed so much. I mean, women are still told a lot of things that they shouldn’t be told. I hate the word geriatric pregnancies. When you’re in your 30s and if you don’t have a baby, it’s considered “geriatric.” That means you’re an old person. Can you imagine? It’s so disrespectful to women. Let’s not let them define us as women or put us in a box and say, “Oh, well, because now you’re this age, you should only play a grandmother.” I’m like, “Hell, no.

I will kick ass because I want to, and I still can.”Since the huge success of “Crazy Rich Asians” and then “Everything Everywhere All at Once,” do you feel like movies with Asian protagonists are being financed more easily? I think in recent years, you’ll find there were more. And I hope they continue in that way, because it’s not every day you get “Everything Everywhere All at Once.” But if you look at the other — I hate to say — Caucasian films, they keep telling many different stories.

So this is what we have to do, which is to tell many stories so that we will continue to have a seat at the table and be able to be part of that whole scene. That responsibility falls on us. And we have a very strong group of people, like Daniel Dae Kim, Destin Daniel Cretton and Jon Chu, who will stick their necks out and say, ‘Yes, we have to find movies that tell our stories as well.’You just made that movie with Sean Baker that will be presented here in Berlin and shot in Malaysia, right?

Yes. In Penang. It was amazing. Han Chong, a fashion designer from Self-Portrait, came up with this very clever idea about bringing arts and fashion and telling the story with his clothes. And he went to me and to Sean Baker and he put the two of us together, we were like, ‘Yes, we have to do this!’ And when they sent me the synopsis, I was going, ‘Are you crazy? What are we doing?’ And then in two days, we made a short film.

So Sean Baker is an astounding filmmaker. I mean, he was on the bicycle with his iPhone!That sounds dangerous! That’s exactly what I said to him! I said, ‘Maybe you shouldn’t do that!’ He said, ‘Don’t worry. I was a delivery boy in New York on a bicycle.’ But then on the first take, I almost crashed into him.Did the experience make you want to do a movie with him? Oh, hell, yes. Anytime he calls, I will be there.Are you currently filming “Avatar 4”?

“Avatar 4” hasn’t started yet. I’m currently filming “The Wandering Earth 3” in China.And “Avatar 4” is filming when?

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